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This week in a special segment we finally have a clever name for, "Sister City Crime," we're briefly touching on one of Caitlyn's major no-no topics with the case of Sofia Zhukova in one of Portland's sister cities. We're visiting the Russian city Khabarovsk. Some details are far too sadistic and salacious for the show notes but others like her missing date of birth are just wild!
If the topic proves to be entirely too upsetting for your stomach we highly recommend revisiting the Pittock Mansion or Heathman Hotel episodes that have recently been featured by platforms aimed at supporting indie podcast discovery. A big round of applause and many thanks to Feed Drops, the Indie Drop-In Network, & Sitch Radio!
This week we shared a promo for Serial Sistaaas!
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If you're a frequent PNW Haunts & Homicides listener, you probably already know where Birdie ambassadors.
Caitlyn:We wanted to take a quick moment to tell you a little bit more about this awesome product
Cassie:Birdie is the modern personal safety alarm, made for women by women.
Caitlyn:In a situation where you feel threatened or unsafe, you can simply activate Birdie's loud siren and flashing light to create a diversion.
Cassie:Birdie is perfect to carry anytime because the device is lightweight and comes in a variety of colors.
Caitlyn:So important. Use our ambassador link and coupon code PNWHAUNTSANDHOMICIDES to receive 10% off your purchase. Like our social media handles, the coupon code is all spelled out no special characters.
Cassie:You can find the link and promo code in our show notes or PNW Haunts & Homicides Linktree.
Together:Have a safe ass day!
Caitlyn:As indie podcasters, we love to show our support of other awesome shows. So stay tuned for the promo we've got to share with you this week.
Cassie:Let's show them some love! You can find their info in our show notes.
Serial Sistaaas:I'm Devin. I'm Audie. And we recap True Crime documentaries. Yeah, we're a true crime comedy podcast because you know what you need? Some laughter when you're dealing with some terrible bullshit. How are you going to talk about serial killers without you know roasting them in between? Oh yes we deem people soggy bowls of cereal. Sometimes a wet sock. Here to cover true crime big and small. From Abducted in Plain Sight, Lesbian Vampire Killers, The Woman Who Wasn't There, and Tiger King. We have it all, we shit on all of them. What you want? Serial killers, embezzlement, fraud? We've got it covered. Even some art theft here and there. Join the banter between us, two sisters that can sometimes hate each other. Sometimes? But overall choose to spend our time entertaining you guys with the crazy documentaries we've watched the night before. And to bring more awareness. Join us every week for a new episode of Serial Sistaaas! Available everywhere you get your podcasts, you can find us at Serial Sistaaas. That's Sistaaas with three A's. S-I-S-T-A-A-A-S.
Together:You guys, we're back!
Cassie:And don't worry, we did get more wine.
Caitlyn:Well, of course.
Intro Music:[Spooky, suspenseful, awesome music]
Caitlyn:Hi, Cassie.
Cassie:Hi, Caitlin.
Caitlyn:Hi, creepy people.
Cassie:Hi, creepy people.
Caitlyn:Helloooo. This is PNW Haunts & Homicides. Let's see, do we have any business to insert before we get into it?
Cassie:Well, I don't know if anybody else noticed that we have a new song. And it's all thanks to Caitlyn.
Caitlyn:I - yeah, I made it.
Cassie:She totally did, no. [Giggle]
Caitlyn:With my own two hands and the help of a very nice person on Fiverr. Yeah, I would have done that probably a while ago if I'd known how easily it could be done.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:But I spent hours vetting all of the different creators and messaged a few and was kind of like, uuh, this music is going to be our forever song. [Worried tone] Yeah. And then I made [messed up Chris's name, we both make fun]. And then I made Chris look at a bunch of them, and I was like, "who do you think will be better? Uh, what do I say?"
Cassie:Yeah, but it turned out great.
Caitlyn:I know I love it.
Cassie:You picked a really good person. And I love the song. Hopefully everyone else does. They better! [Deep, menacing voice]
Caitlyn:Yeah, just - just like it, okay? Just like it a lot, okay. 'Cause I paid for this one. It's ours. And we're a little emotionally attached to this one now.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:We thought we were emotionally attached to the other song.
Cassie:But that song was free. So meaning everyone else, anyone else, who wants to use it could use it. So it wasn't ours, ours. You know what I mean?
Caitlyn:Yeah. And as it turns out, other people were using it. When we found that out, we thought "aw, shucks."
Cassie:I mean, we knew it was a possibility. But when you're starting a podcast, there's other things that you have to spend money on. And that was one of the ones we were like, well, we found this great song. It's free, so we're gonna use it.
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:But, we've moved on.
Caitlyn:I know, we loved that song. We loved, loved, loved it. And I think this one still kind of in the same vein.
Cassie:Yeah, it's very similar. But it's ours!
Caitlyn:But it's ours! [Sigh] Sometimes I stay up late at night, just listening to it. Over and over and over. [Laughter from both]
Cassie:And now we know how crazy Caitlyn is.
Caitlyn:Yeah, no. No, but I did when we first got it. I listened to it several times and was super excited. And yeah. It's ours!
Cassie:Yay!
Caitlyn:Well, alright, that's enough of that. We don't we don't want to get too emotional here. Especially today. I know, I know. In other news [somber giggle]. All
Cassie:Oh, nooo. right. Well, I'm going to dive into it. This is maybe slightly on the short side compared to some of the notes I've put together for other recent cases, but holy wow factor. This one's pretty wild. Yeah, I think it might not be a bad thing. We'll see. We may just end up having a lot of freaking out on the air type. Alright.
Caitlyn:Yeah, I don't know. We'll see. I feel like there's a few things to banter about, but we'll see. Okay, maybe too eeked out.
Cassie:Great. [Laughter]
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:I guess it's your turn to do it to me.
Caitlyn:Yeeaaah. This is really one of our first true sister city cases.
Cassie:Ooh, oooo.
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:You'll have to explain what that is, to me 'cause-
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:I don't get it.
Caitlyn:Yeah I willl, yeah. So we've gone up to like BC and
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:They - they were not light hearted cases. But I tried Toronto for some cases before. And you know, we did that in a couple of different instances where then we were able to kind of have a discussion with DP following and some kind of extra fun like Patreon stuff. And usually those end up being a little bit more lighthearted. Which, I mean, thank God because both of those cases were pretty rough. to- [Giggle] Yeah, so the sister city idea that I sort of
Cassie:Nnno. had because I think there's so many interesting cases, and so many interesting haunts to, abroad. I thought, well, let's - let's keep it on theme for PNW still if we can. And so for Seattle, or Portland, and I'm sure there's a ton of other cities in the Pacific Northwest that have sister cities. And so we'll look into that more as we kind of work our way through some of them. But the sister cities are essentially, international cities that we have formed kind of a special friendship with. And what do you do when you want to be friends with someone and then make it official? You of course, you know, there's money that changes hands and, you know, special - [Giggle] I'm sure there's a lot of paperwork involved. You know, it's kind of like what, what better to commemorate the love that two people have for each other than to, you know, sign a - a what's essentially a deed of sale. Like, are they getting married? What's happening?
Caitlyn:Yeah, I mean, they're not really married, but they are like certified besties.
Cassie:Interesting. I didn't even know that was a thing.
Caitlyn:Yeah. So I've got a list of several cities that are our sister cities in both Seattle and Portland and like I said, I'll look for Sister Cities of other PNW towns and cities. And if you have one in mind, or you know of a case, that happened somewhere abroad, and it's one of our sister cities, you can write in with those suggestions too. Yeah.
Cassie:Okay. So they're not - I always thought they were cities with the same name, is that not the case?
Caitlyn:No [giggle].
Cassie:Oh ok.
Caitlyn:No, because this one... oh [giggle]. I picked a really, a really rough one in terms of like, pronunciation to start with. So...
Cassie:Great.
Caitlyn:Yeah. So for instance, one of Portland's Sister Cities is Guadalajara.
Cassie:Oh!
Caitlyn:Um, not where we're going today. But we definitely could in the future. So definitely not the same name or really like any commonality on that front. But we're, we're certified besties. So we'll see what we can dig up down there. Yeah, I just thought it was kind of a fun and unique
Cassie:Alright [giggle]. sort of premise and might, might give us a little bit of a challenge in kind of looking for some unique things that maybe wouldn't you maybe won't be hearing about on a lot of other shows? [Messed up "other," giggle about it] Yeah, because we're PNW based. So technically, anything we talk about, can be considered PNW, because we're talking about it. And we're sitting in the PNW, so. [Laughter]
Caitlyn:Yeah. I mean, that's true. Like we are PNW, we don't necessarily have to confine all cases.
Cassie:It's like a vacation.
Caitlyn:Yeah. But I thought like, this is a way to kind of still like, do it. And I like kind of fun, creative sort of cheeky way, so.
Cassie:Yeah, dark, creepy vacation that we're taking with
Caitlyn:Yeah, right. Right, like, what is that? There was a
Cassie:Yeah, that's a really good show. you guys. show I watched I think it was called Dark Tourism on Netflix.
Caitlyn:Yeeeaaah.
Cassie:I feel like they didn't have enough seasons. Like, are they still making that.
Caitlyn:They sure didn't. Yeah, I think there was one season.
Cassie:[Sigh] We need to get on - can we get on that show?
Caitlyn:I know right. Let's just remake that show!
Cassie:Yeah. It's easy to get a TV show on Netflix. Right?
Caitlyn:I mean, everything I understand, leads me to believe so.
Cassie:All right, well.
Caitlyn:How hard could it be? Like I'm channeling my inner Elle Woods. Like, "what? Like it's hard."
Cassie:Exactly. [Giggles]
Caitlyn:All right, Cassie. Now my last case, hit a little too close to home. At least for me personally, since it took place in the state that Cassie and I call home. So basically, I packed a bag and left immediately. [Laughter] The next one that we're going to talk about today is hardly any lighter. But you know what you signed up for? So pack your bags, Baby, we're going international. We're visiting one of Portland, Oregon's sister cities in Russia.
Cassie:Ooh [surprised].
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:I wasn't expecting that.
Caitlyn:[Laugh] Yeah, it's a great time to travel to Russia [sarcasm].
Cassie:Yeah, I've heard that [more sarcasm & laughter].
Caitlyn:Actually, there's a number of government resource websites that highly advise if you are planning to travel to Russia, um, don't! Because we will not send for you. And also if you are currently in Russia, GTFO.
Cassie:If you can. That's rough man.
Caitlyn:Yeah, yeah. No, I think it's pretty rough times. I Yes. I don't think there was a single aspect of thought I hadn't really been keeping up on the Brittney Griner case. And I've been hearing more and more about it recently. And it's definitely interesting to hear about some of the developments and some of the negotiation going on with that as I was researching for this. this case that played to any of my preconceived notions. Let's just say it's a bit of a force majeure that way.
Cassie:That was a fancy word you just used.
Caitlyn:It is. Well, you know, I'm continuing on with the trend of using fancy foreign words like you did in the in the spell jar video. So, you know, just trying to keep up. [Laughter]
Cassie:I don't even know how to pronounce that, you guys. It's French.
Caitlyn:Uuuuuh.
Together:[Trying to pronounce "mise en place" not doing very
Caitlyn:That sounds more like the German pronunciation.
Cassie:I am German, so it's probably natural to come out of well] my mouth like that.
Caitlyn:You're - you're just channeling. You're channeling. [Laughter from both] Now, maybe you think based on the location that you've got a pretty good idea what we're going to be talking about today, as far as the case. Obviously, if you thought it was Brittney Griner, uh, it's not that.
Cassie:Okay.
Caitlyn:And if you actually guessed correctly, you must be doing some seriously dark internet lurking like yours truly. So just a friendly reminder to be careful online and probably clear the old search history, babes.
Cassie:Uh Oh.
Caitlyn:Also, just really quick another point that's important to mention, if violence perpetrated against a child - though, I'm relieved to tell you all not of a sexual nature - is going to be too rough for you today, then maybe it's time to just take a walk down memory lane, circle back to an old spooky episode of Cassie's. Like the Pittock Mansion, or the Heathman Hotel episodes that have recently been featured [Oprah's excited voice].
Cassie:So featured!
Caitlyn:Yeah, and I just wanted to really take a second to give a big round of applause. And many thanks to Feed Drops, The indie Drop-In Network, and Sitch Radio. Or you can also check out another podcast that we've recommended along the way. If you don't know this, because you skip the promo material. This is a really good reminder that most of what we share is actually other podcasts that we think you guys might enjoy. We share at least one promo roll every week. And we have for quite some time. There's also a ton of shows to check out on the feed drops that we've told you all about in recent weeks, when we've been featured or when friends of ours have been featured. So give them a shot because they really do a great job of highlighting other indie podcasts. And we know that we can't quite produce enough content for you to fill all of your waking hours. But obviously, come on back next week. Okay.
Cassie:Please!
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:We miss you!
Caitlyn:But there's so much love for you know, especially in true crime and paranormal we know that, you know, you gotta have it. Gotta get that fix. All right, all PSAs and important announcements accomplished for the moment. We'll just get into it. I guess.
Cassie:I'm not ready, but I will sit here and take it.
Caitlyn:Yeah [laughter from both]. We'll see how this goes. Because this case actually gets into one of my personal no-no topics. That's right, I do occasionally stumble on shit too dark and nasty, even for me.
Cassie:Oooh nooo.
Caitlyn:Somehow, but I'm definitely getting ahead of myself. I'm not going to specifically provide a trigger warning for this portion of the content. Hopefully we don't piss anybody off. My no no topic, because we're going to talk about it as little as possible. K, deal? Bitchin'. [Giggle] I don't want to talk about it either. So that's it. No let's get geographical. Okay, you can't really - [Sings in Olivia Newton-John like a champ] "let's get G-O-graphical, graphical."
Cassie:That worked perfectly!
Caitlyn:Okay, okay. I have a - I have a promising music career. Same [also sarcasm]. Do you want to start a band in the garage? [Sarcasm] [Laughing, quoting Step Brothers again] You know what? Honestly, I was thinking, What can I do in my spare time? You know. Oh, my gosh, you know what I don't have a promising career in? Pronouncing Russian words, names, cities. It's not going to be good. Okay. And I know that there's like a little there's like a, I don't know exactly how big the sliver is, but there's a little sliver of, of that Russian DNA going on in my 23andMe or my Ancestry. This is not something I'm going to breeze through. Unlike Cassie, who just you know, she just the German just spills out of her.
Cassie:Not true [laughter from both].
Caitlyn:Okay, everybody take a deep breath. I'm going to try to just channel my inner witch and just, you know, magic this city's name out of me.
Cassie:You got this?
Caitlyn:Okay. Khabarovsk is a city on the Amur River in
Cassie:Okay, interesting. Southeast Asia, located about 19 miles or 30 kilometers from the
Caitlyn:Yeah. Khabarovsk boasts a recorded population of more than half a million residents. That's as of the 2010 census. I Chinese-Russian border. Not only is it the easternmost city in didn't really see a lot of more recent data. So if their population trend is anything like what it is here in Portland, it may be doubled by now. This particular part of Russia is also known for its foreboding weather conditions, due to the extreme climate of the region. It's my literal Russia, it's actually so close to the neighboring country of nightmare. Like so much pertaining to this case. But the weather really. [Laughter]
Cassie:Is it hot?
Caitlyn:No. And also Yes. [More laughter] The winters are characterized as bitterly cold. Because that's, I think, what China, that unless you zoom in on the map a bit, you could everyone thinks of when you say Russia.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:Followed by hot, humid summers.
Cassie:[Sarcatically] Oh nice.
Caitlyn:Which I assume last for like nine months out of the year, they make it sound very extreme. It sounds terrible. But we're not here for a full ass geography or meteorology lesson. glance quickly and believe that it is actually in fact a part of So that's enough for now just to get acquainted with our sister in crime. One thing I did find that was really cool. I want to give a little credit to a really helpful YouTube video, I watched, in addition to reading literally every possible news article on the case that I could get my hands on. But props to the creator, it's True Crime in Russia. It's really hard to find the adjacent Asian country. source material that isn't clickbait coming out of Russia, y'all.
Cassie:That makes sense.
Caitlyn:Yes. I was briefly concerned that my computer was
Cassie:I like that name. I think you did good. no longer going to computer. And I was like this - this might be a paperweight now. The duplicitous dame of the day is Sofia Ivanova Zhukova. Okay.
Caitlyn:Sofia, Ivanova Zhukova.
Cassie:Nice.
Caitlyn:I think that's really, pretty close?
Cassie:It sounds, Russia.
Caitlyn:Yeah, she said, hopefully. [Giggling] With the head tilt to match, of course. She was a Russian serial killer, who is believed to have committed three murders between 2005 and 2019. At the time of her last crime, she was 80 years old.
Cassie:What?! [Stunned] Wow.
Caitlyn:Yeah. Making her the oldest serial killer in the history of Russia and the Soviet Union.
Cassie:Dang, how do you have the energy?
Caitlyn:I know!
Cassie:What are you eating girl?
Caitlyn:Honestly, at this point, like morality, sure. Okay, the law, obviously. [Sarcastic tone] But like, I think really high up there for not committing deadly crimes, like, my energy level.
Cassie:Yeah!
Caitlyn:Like, I just don't think I've got what it takes to pull it off. Like when I was in my 20s.
Cassie:It's, it's far too much work. [Sarcastic tone] Yeah.
Caitlyn:I think so. So not exactly how I would want to make [Sympathetic aughing] A lot of Russian words yeah! the Guinness World Records. But don't worry, she's gonna get hers. Born 1939 In the village of - holy Russian words, um... I'm not kidding when I say - I just showed Cassie.
Cassie:Oooh boy!
Caitlyn:So it's - This is a name of a tiny rural village and it is four separate words (Zvyagino Nizhny Novgorod Oblast). And they are all two or more syllables each. We're going to call it "Zeno" 'cause, we're not going to talk about it again. I'll put the actual name of this place in the show notes. Russians hard y'all. And this has very little payoff. So, "Zeno" okay. It's a very rural community characterized perhaps most accurately as a hamlet. Which makes it super weird that it has this crazy complicated name but
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:K [giggle].
Cassie:What's the hamlet?
Caitlyn:It's like when you're too small to be a city or town. Oh, and village feels like maybe to colloquial, I guess?
Cassie:Weird, okay.
Caitlyn:Yeah, supes small.
Cassie:Maybe it's named after the four people that live there.
Caitlyn:Ha ha! It might be. I mean, and they're all family members of hers [sarcasm].
Cassie:[Laughing] Oh, yeah!
Caitlyn:Oh my god, that was so good. That was so good. [Giggles]
Cassie:Thanks!
Caitlyn:My little comedian. What would I do without? Yeah, that was so funny. I literally was like oh my god [still lauging].
Cassie:Sooo funny [valley girl].
Caitlyn:I got a little chortle there, that was funny.
Cassie:I'm surprised you didn't think of that first.
Caitlyn:I was like, why did I not think that? That is hilarious! I don't know. I was probably just like, freaking the fuck out trying to, like figure out how I was ever going to pronounce this. Yeah. I not gonna. But that brings me to an interesting point. I have not seen any coverage of her case that indicated her date of birth could be determined. Did you notice I said born 1939.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:All we know is the year.
Cassie:Oh, okay.
Caitlyn:All we know is the year. I want to know if she knew when her birthday was.
Cassie:Oh, that's really sad.
Caitlyn:I have no idea. I literally could not find anything. And I looked in UK, like, you know, papers that are published in England in Ireland. I tried looking at some Russian news sites and Ukrainian ones. And that's when my computer threatened to no computers, so...
Cassie:Oh my gosh, yeah.
Caitlyn:I got nothing on that, guys. I don't know.
Cassie:Well, do we really care? Honestly.
Caitlyn:I don't. You know, I don't think so. I mean, don't get me wrong, there is definitely not a surprise party in her future or anything. It's just so bizarre to think there wouldn't be some sort of record?
Cassie:Yeah. Well, maybe because the small town she was born in maybe there wasn't offical...?
Caitlyn:I thought that. But I also was trying to kind of look into like some of the historical pieces of, you know, what's going on in that region throughout her life. So I did find some things that I thought maybe maybe that explains it. Okay. So maybe that has something to do with the fact that Mother Russia, known as the USSR, at the time, was pretty busy invading countries like Poland and Finland. I'm thinking especially in a rural area, probably the records pertaining to births, I'd imagine maybe even some other critical records for that matter. Like, I don't know, maybe deaths. And or, you know, maybe other notable facets of history weren't exactly top notch around this time?
Cassie:I could see that.
Caitlyn:Yeah. I mean, when you're invading a country, that kind of tends to become your singular focus. Yeah. For the most part, that's really just pure speculation on my part, but I think it feels like a fair guess.
Cassie:I mean, what else you're gonna do. Right?
Caitlyn:Yeah. If anyone has a connect to getting access to Russian records, um, I'm good for you. Don't email us, because I'm literally terrified of you. [Laughter] Okay. I could be wrong, but I feel like that would be some Anonymous level shit. And listen, I don't need to know that badly. They've certainly got bigger fish to fry. Okay.
Cassie:Yeah, totally.
Caitlyn:We love your work. Huge fan.
Cassie:[Giggles] Yeah.
Caitlyn:As an adult, Sofia Zhukova was a laborer. She hadn't been given the opportunity of an education. And I think of course, it's really sad when someone doesn't have the ability to read or write with at least a A basic level of fluency even in their own native language, but I promise that sympathetic feeling won't last, you know, just on the off chance that you're feeling it coming on right now.
Cassie:Shoving it away.
Caitlyn:Right? Yeah. Eew, I almost felt a thing.
Cassie:Ew!
Caitlyn:"Ew Devid!" [In her very best Alexis impression] At some point as a young woman, she moved from her rural birthplace, "Zeno" to the city of Khabarovsk. Which I can say.
Cassie:Yes, you can. You're really good at it.
Caitlyn:Yeah, I'm like, I've practiced. It's important to the story. So I was like, okay, that's still scary Russian word, but I - that I can hack. She lived on the outskirts of the city where she did marry and have two sons. This is another point of contention in her biographical data, though, because some sources say she had three children in total, one having passed away fairly young.
Cassie:[Sad] Aaw.
Caitlyn:Despite there being some possible confusion about exactly how many children she really did have. There's very little debate that the two confirmed sons moved away as soon as they could, and eventually cut off all contact from her.
Cassie:Hmm, weird.
Caitlyn:She must have been a pretty cantankerous lady because it sounds like that was all well before anyone knew just how depraved she would become.
Cassie:Oooo.
Caitlyn:So just in her, like, normal family life, she was apparently that much of a nightmare.
Cassie:Wow.
Caitlyn:Her husband passed away in 2005, which is, of course tough on anyone to lose their partner. But some serious psychological changes are believed to have taken place around this time. Which, in hindsight, feels like the most unnecessarily polite way of understating the situation. Like, why - why are we being nice to the serial killers, you guys?
Cassie:Yeah. How would you put it?
Caitlyn:Not a doctor [giggles], so I don't feel as though I should be down by clinical terms. Um, the woman damn lost her mind.
Cassie:Bitch be cray!
Caitlyn:Yeah. She did order the fish fillet. There's literally nothing I could find in various source material that elaborates on this whole psychological changes thing, even a little. But suffice to say, I'm definitely in agreement. It was even alleged, this might have been the reason for her crimes. Which, okay, there's a lot of elderly ladies that lose their husbands. Okay. All right, moving on. Like I said, I'm not a doctor, and thank God, I've never met the woman. So I can't tell you one way or the other. I think sometimes we just need to find the reason behind the horrific things people do. And the truth is, there's never gonna be a good reason. We're never going to be satisfied by that.
Cassie:Absolutely not.
Caitlyn:Yeah, no, I hate it. Thanks, I hate it. Though, oftentimes, the widely reported threats she made weren't taken very seriously. She was known to be frequently quite combative with neighbors. Her appearance was hardly menacing on the surface as an elderly woman despite her curmudgeonly, default setting. [Laughter] Do you like that? Default setting.
Cassie:[Giggling] Curmudgeonly.
Caitlyn:I know, I love the word curmudgeonly. And I really like the idea that people have a default setting.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:I mean, we kind of do.
Cassie:I want to curmudgeonly is my default setting on a t-shirt. [Laughter from both]
Caitlyn:One thing that will stick out, again, really only in hindsight, is that many neighbors described her as unusually strong for an elderly woman that they would have otherwise assumed was quite frail.
Cassie:Hmm, okay.
Caitlyn:So she had previously been a pig butcher.
Cassie:Oh, okay. That's intense.
Caitlyn:That was one of her, like, longtime job functions. One if ger longtime roles. So, clearly comfortable chopping things up?
Cassie:Yeah, and you need muscle for that, so.
Caitlyn:Sure do.
Cassie:Kept her strong.
Caitlyn:Yeah. In fact, she was known to carry an axe around with her frequently, you know, as one does never know when you might need to chop wood.
Cassie:Just this old lady carrying around an axe with her? Just walking down the street?
Caitlyn:I guess.
Cassie:Cup of tea, got your axe, taking your morning walk.
Caitlyn:Like, Russia. I mean, I already know the answer to this, but like, girl, you in danger. Like, girl, are you okay? [Giggle]
Cassie:I mean, self defense. I guess we walk around with, like, Mace and stuff.
Caitlyn:I mean, I feel like that's a whole other animal, but-
Cassie:An axe. [giggle]
Caitlyn:An axe.
Cassie:Were she carrying it? Or did she have like a tool belt?
Caitlyn:You know, it's real hard to find details about that. I think the fact that so many people reported it. That leads me to believe that it was like just open carry.
Cassie:Wow. Okay.
Caitlyn:I don't know, which is worse. I just literally cannot. I don't know which way is up like, me there. Seems like perhaps that was simply her weapon of choice. Oh, oops. I forgot to say spoiler alert.
Cassie:I mean, we kind of saw that coming. I feel like, when you talk about an axe and we know there's going to be a murder...
Caitlyn:Oh, okay. Okay, so you guys, you were following. Okay, great.
Cassie:I think so.
Caitlyn:Cool. Cool. Cool. Cool.
Cassie:That was just a check if anyone was listening.
Caitlyn:Yeah, yeah. Most of what the modern lexicon tells us about female killers is that women more often than not choose poison when it comes to murder. But you'll see that Granny Zhukova definitely goes her own way.
Cassie:I can't imagine.
Caitlyn:Yeah. I recommend if you are someone who usually visualizes Don't. Yeah, try - really fight that impulse. Yeah. The local community wasn't totally in the
Cassie:Yeah, thanks. dark about Zhukova developing propensity for cruelty and violence. Because obviously, she carried around acts. So I mean, doesn't seem like that far of a stretch, but also they just assumed it was reserved for the local cats. What!? [Devistated] She chopped up cats?
Caitlyn:[Sadly] Yeah. And while they had reportedly complained to authorities about this, nothing seems to have been done.
Cassie:W-why?
Caitlyn:I don't know.
Cassie:Oh, my gosh, all leaders are supposed to be, like, have 1,000 cats not chopped them up with axes.
Caitlyn:I know. Very, very off brand for grannies. But Hindsight is 2020 my dudes fitting on multiple fronts. If you ask me. Then in December of 2005, Anastasia Alexeenko went missing. My research indicates this was a short time before Christmas, probably on the 14th. I don't get the feeling that the assumption was immediately that she had been kidnapped. But she sure was. What a terrible time of year to do something awful like this. And there's not a good time, just to clarify.
Cassie:No.
Caitlyn:But seriously, what are you the Grinch?
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:Anastasia's age has been reported as either seven or eight, depending on the source. So I don't know if her birthday was sometime around this time of year. And maybe that's where that maybe gets lost in the reporting. It's really hard to track down anything that appeared to reliably confirm her true age. And I didn't want to just pick one. Obviously, this case comes to us from a foreign country that in many ways, isn't really transparent with the other parts of the world, particularly the West. And a good deal of the coverage really just focuses on sensationalizing the case. And I mean, there's a lot of fodder, so not totally - I mean, I get it. I hate it, but I get it.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:So like I said, Good luck finding Russian based sources that don't just crash or spam your device. I cannot stress this enough. Hopefully I don't have to buy a used typewriter to take notes on after this. [Giggles] Yeah, yeah. Although if I'm being honest, the clickety clackety of those old school typeface letters. I don't hate it. Alright, enough of the Norman Mailer fantasy. It's about to get dark.
Cassie:[Reluctantly] Okay.
Caitlyn:Zhukova was said to have held Anastasia for three weeks prior to the girl being hacked to death by the gruesome granny.
Cassie:[Very sadly] No.
Caitlyn:Really going off book here. It's unknown whether this was at her home or somewhere else. And it's mostly just speculation to what end she did this besides perhaps maybe her enjoyment of the obvious brutality she inflicted on the girl. I mean, we're not going to get a good explanation as to why she held her for so long.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:And it seems like literally the most awful messiest and just horrific way to kill someone.
Cassie:Lizzie borden would know.
Caitlyn:Girl, you know exactly where my head was that we're leaving that in. [Laughter] When she finally got her fill of that, Zhukova then dismembered the young girl's body. Throwing the remains in a bag, which she left on the street. We'll come back to this.
Cassie:Okay.
Caitlyn:Right about now you're probably wondering, what was the girl's crime, exactly? What did she do to piss Granny Zhukova off this badly?
Cassie:Yeah?
Caitlyn:What does a young girl possibly do that drives someone to this level of brutality? She made too much noise.
Cassie:Oh, come on. It's a kid!
Caitlyn:There's I know. And there's literally never a good reason to harm a child, obviously. I mean, listen, we've all had a neighbor, friend, or family member with an obnoxious kid. But this feels pretty extreme, no?
Cassie:Yeah. I mean, all kids are pretty much obnoxious.
Caitlyn:Right? I mean, truly from the mouths of childless, 30 something women, right? But I'm like, [so high pitched] yeah, but murder, though. What? No, no, we don't do that. Okay, well, just wanted to check in and make sure we're all on the same page here. Two weeks later, the girls partial remains were discovered. Though no one suspected the elderly woman of any crime much less something this horrific initially. Which is particularly appalling, because remember, I said we'd come back to this. It was her head that was discovered initially. And it seems like only later those in the area would come to the realization that in their recollection, there had been some meat that had been scattered in the street and eaten by stray dogs. And that was likely other portions of the poor girl's remains.
Cassie:Oh my goodness. Man...
Caitlyn:Aaand I have no words and I think we quit.
Cassie:That's gruesome as fuck, dude.
Caitlyn:I know. I have in the words of the amazing Meryl Streep, "I cahn't." Later Zhukova would confess. But this would be for a different crime. The murder of the janitor that had rented a room from her.
Cassie:Okay [nervous laughter].
Caitlyn:Yeah. Inmates would later share with the authorities the stories they had been told about the murder of a friend of Zhukova's. This would eventually lead to a more detailed confession from Zhukova. But as they often do, this serial killer would also later retract it just months later. Seriously, Lady get a hobby take up knitting, for crying out loud. Confess, retract, rinse, wash, repeat. That was her motto. Apparently.
Cassie:You can't confess to killing somebody and then take it back, like - [short sardonic laugh].
Caitlyn:But they all fucking do it!
Cassie:Oh my god.
Caitlyn:They all do, like "oh, just kidding."
Cassie:Wow.
Caitlyn:Really? Hmm. Granny Zhukova claimed she axed the janitor, who was her tenant, to death. Yikes. The landlord from hell apparently.
Cassie:Literally.
Caitlyn:Starting to make mine look pretty good. [Laughter from both] Even after that hellish bathroom demo. She confessed to the murder of 52 year old Vasily (Shlyaklhtich). I tried Vasily your last name is a lot. I feel like it's just sounds that our American mouths don't make.
Cassie:Yeah. Like you have to train your brain to do that.
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:And that's really hard.
Caitlyn:Yeah. She confessed to the murder of 52 year old Vasily in court, claiming that he and her friend said they wanted to have tea with her. But instead they raped her.
Cassie:Okay.
Caitlyn:And his organs were found in her fridge. And other body parts belonging to this victim were located nearby. From what I gather, they were found in rubbish containers that were publicly accessible. So like dumpsters?
Cassie:Okay.
Caitlyn:Horrifyingly, she acted out the scene of the axe murder in a reconstruction that was created for the purposes of the trial.
Cassie:Okay, I feel like that's, like, self incriminating or something. You know what I mean?
Caitlyn:Yeah, pretty tough to like, retract that confession or plead the fifth there after? I mean, you can try. Yeah, so, guys, the photos for this case are going to be wild. During the trial, she was also kept in a literal cage. It's like, the Hannibal, like-
Cassie:No way.
Caitlyn:You're just gonna have to see the pictures.
Cassie:Oh my gosh.
Caitlyn:From which she frequently ranted and raved because, you know, obviously. We'll link to some of these photos. If you want to see them, just be advised, they're deeply unsettling. For some reason, I don't know why. But it's an old lady in a cage and she definitely looks fully insane. I'll try to find some of the kind of PG ones for her post.
Cassie:Okay.
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:I'm not gonna look at them. [Nervous laughter]
Caitlyn:I don't, yeah, I don't recommend that you look at anything we don't put on the socials. Like, if you're on the fence, like, idk maybe don't. Yeah, eek. Neighbors of Zhukova alleged in the many reflections that they provided to media outlets, that she was always offering the children in the neighborhood food suspiciously of a meat variety.
Cassie:No.
Caitlyn:They believe she may have cooked up human meat from her victims offering it to unsuspecting people.
Cassie:That's disgusting.
Caitlyn:I...
Cassie:What the fuck.
Caitlyn:Mhm. Though, this hasn't exactly been confirmed by authorities, as best I can tell. These stories are very widely circulated in connection with her case. And like, all of the neighbors are like, come on guys. Two plus two equals, you know, involuntary cannibalism. And now we're going to say goodbye to my no-no topic, so that we don't have to make a puke break part of our regular podcasting platform.
Cassie:Okay...
Together:[Mimic throwing up]
Cassie:I'm hoping that that's just like the urban legend of the crazy old lady who killed people and fed it to children - fed them to children.
Caitlyn:Yeah, I you know, I mean, she did be it to the dogs, which is really horrific as well. But yeah, I'm hoping this is kind of more urban legend. I hope so. That's what I'm gonna go with. It'll help me fall asleep tonight.
Cassie:Yeah exactly.
Caitlyn:There's more than neighbors had to say on the subject but because it's all conjecture, and I would like to be able to eat again sometime this month, we are moving on for realsies. Zhukova's third victim was an elderly woman that she was reportedly friends with, named Nina Babenko. She was an 83 year old pensioner, as the Brits are fond of saying, What can I say? I picked it up from reading their coverage of the case. Okay. I'm not gonnna apologize. They also say rubbish and all kinds of other stuff. I think it sounds fancy.
Cassie:I don't know what it means.
Caitlyn:What rubbish or pensioner?
Cassie:Pensioner.
Caitlyn:Oh, it's basically like a retired person.
Cassie:Oh, okay.
Caitlyn:From what I gather. Apparently this woman had been another lodger with Zhukova. She'd recently sold her home and brought that large amount of cash with her. A frail elderly woman with a boatload of money on her hands. What could go wrong? Though her passport was found Zhukova's. home, she has never been seen again. Nor her remains recovered.
Cassie:Aaw, eh...
Caitlyn:Which kind of lends a little bit of credence potentially to that previous no-no theory - topic. This too, is another confession that she would later
Cassie:Yeah...huh It could happen, right? retract. Though at her trial, it would be heard by the jury that I suppose. Right? her initial testimony included a confession to this murder as
Caitlyn:Yeah. Well, here's the thing that's a little bit - it's well. Zhukova also had a wild story about the two of them getting into an argument. She said Nina ended up taking off with someone in a nondescript (of course) vehicle, possibly with a relative after she received her latest pension payment. So weird, you guys, she literally got her money and then she was just like, okay, like, I'm done arguing with you, bye forever. interesting about this area of the world, but it's also like, kind of suspish. They apparently bring - oh this is cute I went British, ha - they apparently bring them round in person there. Which is a nice service for the elderly or those that are otherwise limited in terms of mobility. So for people that are like on disability or that are, you know, these, you know, pensioners retirees, they personally take them their, you know, their pension pay out.
Cassie:Oh, okay.
Caitlyn:So we know she was there, for sure, and alive on the date of that last payment. I don't know what day that was.
Cassie:Of course not.
Caitlyn:But no, but I think it's a really interesting detail. And even though I don't have the specific date, I wanted to include it because the postman reportedly said everything seemed fine when he made the drop off. Nina's daughter, though, called bullshit on the story that Zhukova cooked up. Now, I'm sorry that there's not more detail to share about the court proceedings, because it sounds like things got [pronouncing it with a "Wh" like Stewie from Family Guy] Wild! But this tidbit is certainly one of the most interesting details and one of the more damning facts of the case. Trace amounts of the youngest victim, Anastasia, were found in Zhukova's home despite the child having vanished 14 years earlier, prior to her brutalized remains being discovered weeks later.
Cassie:Okay.
Caitlyn:So there's DNA evidence in this woman's home, showing that that child was there expressing some amount of her DNA, it sounds like it was blood. Her severed head was found, her face having the appearance of being very badly beaten. Which is terribly sad given the fact that it's really the only substantial portion of her remains that was recovered.
Cassie:[Quiet and sad] Oh, man...
Caitlyn:The trace DNA was matched via the girl's mother, Natalia. Some reports also said that Nina's DNA was also found in the home. And Zhukova - this we do know - was suspected in at least four other unsolved murders at the time of her trial.
Cassie:Oh shit.
Caitlyn:Zhukova was found sane by a forensic psychologist and psychiatric examination. Which first of all, how? But actually, that's a good thing.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:Okay, I'll allow it because it means we actually got a freakin trial, at least, I suppose. Except the conclusion of this case isn't exactly super satisfying. Since Zhukova contracted COVID at the end of December 2020. She was admitted to a hospital in the city but did succumb to the virus and her symptoms on December 29. The date of her death was the birthday of another famous Russian serial killer.
Cassie:Weird.
Caitlyn:Yeah [snicker]. Sergei Vasilyevich Ryakhovsky (probably not pronounced correctly) - we don't care. Okay, he's a dick. He was born December 29, 1962. He was a Soviet Russian serial killer convicted for the killing of 19 people in the Moscow area between 1988 and 1993.
Cassie:Jesus, that's a lot.
Caitlyn:Mhm. That's all I really have in terms of synchronicity on this one. There's some I just can't say that I'm fond of it at all. So what was - how did that song go that they sung at the end of the Wizard of Oz? "Ding Dong, the witch is dead."
Cassie:Yay!
Caitlyn:I don't know. I feel like that is, uh, I mean, at least she's not able to do any more harm. But it's like, dang!
Cassie:I have questions.
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:So they did like a psychiatric evaluation on her. I was kind of wondering if she had dementia or something. Did they check any of that out? Or was that part of the psychological thing? Or?
Caitlyn:You know, I don't know that they actually detailed whether or not that was specifically part of it. But I would think given her age, that's typically something that they would look at. It wasn't named as, like, something specifically that they, you know, we're testing for so to speak. And yeah, no indication that that was identified. But yeah, it was kind of an interesting thought. Because, I mean, there's obviously there are a number of true mental illnesses that would, you know, make this an even more tragic situation for the fact that, you know, this person can't really be held responsible for their, you know, actions.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:No indication that's the case.
Cassie:Not that I think people with dementia are gonna start killing people. I just thought since now, as she was so old, like the age could have be a factor.
Caitlyn:Yeah. I mean, on the whole, dementia isn't something that I think makes most of those patients terribly aggressive. So, I mean, for the most part, if anything that makes them very, very feeble, and they're more likely to be a victim of some type of crime.
Cassie:Yeah.
Caitlyn:Yeah. So tarot, okay. Granny Zhukova. Oh, my God, I cannot shuffle for shit. When we zoom, I feel like I should just have Chris come on the show as a guest to -
Together:Shuffle.
Cassie:Yeah. [Giggles]
Serial Sistaaas:Help, I need an adult!
Caitlyn:Okay, that was a good shuffle, Granny Zhukova. Let's see what we got here. Oh, this is interesting.
Cassie:Okay.
Caitlyn:It literally looks like grumpy old lady you guys and it's-
Cassie:It does!
Caitlyn:The Hermit.
Cassie:Ther Hermit. Wooow. Eeeee!
Caitlyn:Eek! Oh my gosh.
Cassie:If only it had an axe on it.
Caitlyn:[Laughing] I know!
Cassie:Do I need to do some entertaining things while you're?
Caitlyn:Yeah, can you vamp? Gosh, Cassie.
Together:[Laughter]
Cassie:My one move.
Caitlyn:Yeah. Oh my goodness. Okay, so The Hermit - Cassie, this is for the major arcana - do you want to guess what number it is?
Cassie:Nine.
Caitlyn:Mhm.
Cassie:Is it really!?
Caitlyn:Yeah, it is.
Cassie:Weird, okay.
Caitlyn:Yeah. Okay, so our key words are guidance, solitude, inner wisdom, self evaluation. The Hermit is often depicted as a bearded old man, holding a lantern aloft. A seeker after truth, he lights the way ahead for those who follow.
Cassie:Maybe don't follow. [Laughter]
Caitlyn:Yeah, don't - don't follow. He may look like a monk dressed in a plain long rope. As an archetypal elder figure, this age of myth and legend, he radiates wisdom and functions as a teacher and guide. Sometimes he's shone looking away at what only he can see, your future.
Together:[Shocked, grossed out sounds]
Caitlyn:Oh, I hate it.
Cassie:Like, in most circumstances, that wouldn't be like such a bad thing, but -
Caitlyn:I know!
Cassie:Compared to the story, it's creepy.
Caitlyn:When the hermit appears in a reading, it can mean a guide figure is that hand offering help. The card advises you to meet this guide or begin your own search for truth. Sometimes the guide figure is a person, such as a counselor, therapist or clergy member, but usually it refers to inner guidance or getting in touch with a spirit guide. The Hermit can recommend withdrawing from the busyness and distractions of the outer world to do some soul searching.
Cassie:Hmm, they doin' somethin'.
Caitlyn:I dont like it. Oh my gosh. So the extra observed Father Time, The Hermit is often linked with Father Time or Saturn. The planet astrologers connect with obstacles and lessons that come up during the course of our lives. As such, he reminds you to be patient, and brutally honest with yourself as you work to gain perspective.
Cassie:Yeah, someone did not have any patience.
Caitlyn:Seriously. Remember this thing when the student is ready the teacher appears. When this card is upright, you may be looking for guidance from the invisible world. You want to gain perspective on your life, and you're open to the inner guidance that's available to you. The time has come to reunite with source, whether for guidance, to discover the truth or to establish inner balance. In a reading about money, the hermit offers guidance and a financial matter. He may encourage you to seek counsel from someone wiser or more experienced than yourself. Sometimes this card represents turning away from material things to follow a spiritual path. If the reading is about your job, The Hermit may indicate withdrawing from the hectic pace of the workaday world, you seek solitude, wisdom and inner peace. I guess as a retired pig butcher, maybe?
Cassie:She wanted peace. She get rid of everybody.
Caitlyn:Yeah. This card may also mean leaving a job or company and growing your own way independently. In a reading about love, you may feel a need for some time alone to discover things about yourself and your path in life. The Hermit can also indicate a need for more independence or self reliance in a relationship. I don't know if your husband passes away maybe murder isn't the next step for you.
Cassie:Yeah, ugh.
Caitlyn:You know? One more short little excerpt. If the doors of perception were cleansed, everything would appear to man as it is - infinite. William Blake.
Cassie:Interesting.
Caitlyn:Yeah.
Cassie:I think mostly the relatable thing on the card was, it was literally an old woman.
Caitlyn:Yeah, I think there's some bits and pieces, for sure, that kind of, they kind of feel like they pull me back. But yeah, I mean, God, the appearance of it is -
Cassie:Very weird. Because that's the only, I mean, that's the only card in there that would have like an old person on it right?
Caitlyn:Um, you know, I don't know. We might have to do a little, a little study about what other? I'm trying to think. Let's see, I'm gonna go. I know there's probably some others that feature someone of a - of a, of an age elsewhere.
Cassie:Of an age. I know I keep saying old person. I'm sorry if that's offensive to anybody.
Caitlyn:I didn't even think about that. I just like, Yeah, I don't know, I think maybe you could argue. I'm flipping to see. And the tough thing about this deck is that the visual can be a little bit altered from the traditional. I'm not sure. Yeah, I think this is probably one of I mean, a handful at best I would say. Yeah, this was pretty wild.
Cassie:The fact that you pulled one with an elderly person is crazy.
Caitlyn:It does. Yeah, I mean, that matches up for me. Well um, hopefully you've enjoyed this trip to Russia. Um, please don't travel there for real.
Cassie:No, and not on the internet, either.
Caitlyn:Yeah, I'm, yeah, it's probably going to be a while before I do anytime soon.
Cassie:Don't click on any of the source links that she posts. [Giggle]
Caitlyn:No, you know what, I all of my source links are fine. Those are ones that didn't, because most of them you couldn't if they were the scammy ones, it didn't open to anything that I could link.
Cassie:That makes sense.
Caitlyn:Yeah, it was like when you do you remember those popups. And, you know, you still see him occasionally. But I remember like, back in the days of like, the AOL CDs, it would happen a lot. It'd be like "you're the 100th bleh, bleh, bleh, bleh, bleh." and that's a lot. That's pretty much what it was like, so I will not be linking to that. [Giggles]
Cassie:Good to know, good to know. [Giggle]
Caitlyn:Oh, my goodness. Alright, creepy people, we love you.
Cassie:Yeah, we love you so much that we bring you disturbing topics.
Caitlyn:We sure do, yeah.
Cassie:Caitlyn moreso than me, but it's fine.
Caitlyn:Um, agree to disagree. Okay.
Cassie:Okay.
Caitlyn:I'm really excited about the next couple that I have coming up. So on that note,
Together:Have a creepy ass day! See you next Tuesday!
Caitlyn:Don't go to Russia.
Cassie:But not you creepy old granny who eats people.
Caitlyn:I know. Yuck.
Cassie:Allegedly.
Caitlyn:Allegedly.
Cassie:Allegedly.
Caitlyn:Listen, you know she's dead. She probably won't to us.
Cassie:Yeah. Probably not. Suing from the grave.
Caitlyn:[Giggles] I'm dying. Oh my gosh. So for all of you that are listening. If you have any true crime or paranormal stories that you want us to share, maybe with the whole Pacific Northwest.
Cassie:Yes. We would love to read them on the pod.
Caitlyn:Yes, we will read them out loud.
Cassie:[Laughter] Not just in our heads.
Caitlyn:Yes. They don't have to be from the Pacific Northwest. If you would like to share, email us at pnwhauntsandhomicides@gmail.com. It's all spelled out no special characters. Super duper easy peasy.
Cassie:Follow us on Instagram and Facebook. Same thing with the email @pnwhauntsandhomicides all spelled out no special characters. Please also rate and review us on whatever platform you're listening to and check out our stories on social media because our meme game is hot.
Caitlyn:Agreed.
Cassie:And if you agree, like Caitlin, you can also find us on Patreon and support the show.
Caitlyn:Bitchin'. Born 1939 In the village of - pff it is like literally for two syllable words.
Cassie:Oh my god, what!? [Laughing]
Caitlyn:I'm not kidding. Let me see if I could do share screen. This is just like ridick. Can you see that highlighted section now?
Cassie:[Evil laughter] Oh my god.
Caitlyn:What in the actual fuck is that?
Cassie:I mean the last word looks semi easy.
Caitlyn:[Laughing] Right!? Oh my gosh.
Cassie:I wouldn't even know where to begin.
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